Was Jesus a Christian? Part 2.

The Torah was written with the coming (of) Christ in mind. Jesus did accept Adam and Eve, Noah, Babel, Moses and Exodus – *which were all real events.

David Robertson


As a follow up to the previous post I thought I would revisit David Robertson’s blog and include his quote from the same post.


Irrespective what one might think of Robertson I am interested in two things which I’ll cover over two posts
For this post I’d like to explore his (above) quote.


As many of my visitors are former Christians,  I want to know is it really possible that in this highly technological day and age that a person in Robertson’s position sincerely and honestly believes what he wrote regarding ”real events”?

*my bold

Ark


22 thoughts on “Was Jesus a Christian? Part 2.

    1. hi Jz
      Glad to see you are around to discuss these things.

      Consider me a dunce too for believing the record. Is it too much to believe that the present day clouds above your head (yeah those wonderful sights of serendipity) which carry immeasurable weights of water, are evidence of water above which Genesis clearly presents??? Perhaps modern day so called scientists are the true dunces for not admitting what is so obvious.

      So yeah, the ark which was fashioned (not as a cartoon) was admittingly even today, by shipbuilders, built upon the specs for cargo, stability, and engineered (according to the blueprints of Genesis once again) as a testament to He whose ways are perfect. Did you ever research the dimensions for the ark?

      So what’s the big deal in believing court records, er, excuse me, a book which contents have been protected by careful hands such as your Jewish scribe friends, that explain, confirm, ratify, and set forth information such as the sky being as molten glass,,,,,,,,,not just poetic filler, but truths to imprint upon the mind (a sober mind) that God has no worthy competitor, and that in any age, His word is good.

      Btw, Darwin borrowed his ‘species’ from the ‘kinds’ in Genesis. I was thinking about those industrious little fellas, the ants, as a ‘kind’ which I suppose reproduce like themselves, having no desire nor need to ‘change,’ and furthermore embarrass people who are outright lazy.

      Finally, don’t make the mistake of thinking that there are not brilliant people who specialize in many fields, (MD’s, lawyers, infectious disease specialists, scientists, microbiologists, farmers, chessmasters, on and on, who have no issue at all defending what I just told you. You guys may want to rethink your ridicule. So what’s the lie here?

      (Notice I did not mention those idiots Nye and Tyson……………)

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      1. @CalamityJane reckons: “Btw, Darwin borrowed his ‘species’ from the ‘kinds’ in Genesis.”

        A statement rivalled only in its stupidity by Pastor Dave’s one about the Torah above. See, this is why evangelicals have a reputation for dishonesty, because they keep making fatuous assertions to suit their own narrative agendas.

        Read the fucking On the Origin of Species, you putz, and show me where Darwin credits the Bible for the concept of species. It’s pre-Darwinian, and goes back to Linnaean taxonomy. ‘Kind’ has no biological meaning.

        (“Notice I did not mention those two idiots Nye and Tyson…)

        Since those names are as irrelevant as almost everything else you posted to the topic at hand — Robertson’s claims about Jesus and the Torah — it’s not like you did us any special favours.

        You’re the one who comes off looking distinctly like an idiot.

        Liked by 2 people

      2. What’s amazing is that the bird “kind” (Animalia,. Chordata, Amphibia, Aves) had already evolved into two distinct classes — Columbiformes (doves) and Passeriformes (ravens) — during Noah’s year-long voyage. That’s a pretty fast change in heritable characteristics over successive generations.

        BTW, where can one find the carefully protected stone tablets containing the 10 commandments?

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  1. There is a “documentary” on Amazon Prime that claims “Proof for the Bible” and “Proof for God.” The second episode was “6 Amazing Scientific Facts from the Bible.” #1 was that “blood was the liquid of life.” Apparently this was unknown prior to the revelations of the Bible, even to butchers and hunters who bled out animals to kill them and has done so for millennia. The Second was “Sanitation Practices.” After talking about how many centuries to took to for “science” to work out the germ theory of disease and ways to mitigate contagion, the narrator said … “Or you could just have looked in the Bible. In Leviticus (Leviticus!) it says that if you touch a corpse you become unclean and must “self-isolate” (Sound familiar?) for seven days and wash yourself with “water” on the third and fifth days.” In the Bible! It recommends you wash yourself with “germ-killing water” to prevent the spread of contagion.”

    First: touching a corpse doesn’t automatically make you unclean. Maybe if the person had died of a communicable disease, yes, but an arrow through the eye? Not a chance. Second: water doesn’t kill germs … but it does spread them! The narrator probably knew enough, as a modern person, that washing your hands with soapy water would kill germs and just forgot about the soap part.

    I didn’t continue on to #3.

    Liars for Jesus to the left of me; Liars for Jesus to the right of me. Into the Valley of ridiculous documentaries I rode.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. Sideline Steve — I find it amazing that you can sit through some of this garbage! You have a much higher level of bullshit acceptance than me, that’s for sure.

      Liked by 1 person

  2. I’m less concerned about them being “real events” as I am his claim that the Torah was written with the coming of Christ in mind. Yes, there came a time when the Israelites were looking for a Deliverer/Messiah because of all the “bad guys” preying on them, but I don’t think this was the case from the beginning.

    I’m definitely not a bible scholar but from my (limited) knowledge of the Hebrew Bible, I just don’t see it.

    As for the “real events” you asked about … to the evangelical Christian, most definitely YES! They are accepted as genuine people and events. Why would they doubt? After all, their Holy Book was written by their god, so everything in it must be TRUTH.

    Liked by 2 people

  3. Um…I just spoke to my Jewish neighbor, Beverly Strindberg the 45th, and she said the Torah was most definitely NOT written with the coming of Jesus in mind. It was written, according to her, as a recipe book by a guy named Rabbi Horowitz the 22nd but the guy had a really bad problem with mushrooms, yes, THOSE kinds of mushrooms, and rather than writing down recipes for matzoh ball soup and the like, the Torah became…well…it became what it is. Go figure, eh. Oh, she, Mrs. Strindberg, says for a good book on Jesus, read “The Silence of the Lambs” by Thomas Harris in Sanskrit backwards and you’ll learn everything you want to know about him.

    Liked by 1 person

  4. “The Torah was written with the coming (of) Christ in mind.”

    Yeah, because it takes a 21st century Scottish pastor to set the Jews straight regarding their own scripture. Comedian Lewis Black had a few pointed things to say about Christians trying to co-opt the OT.

    Said this before: if the Jews got it wrong when it comes to Christ, then it’s just as likely they got it wrong when it comes to Yahweh, in which case, what are Christians doing worshipping a Hebrew false deity?

    Liked by 2 people

  5. I’m going to try to explain how 4th-century Hellenistic Greek does not and cannot merge smoothly with ancient Semitic languages. Please bear with me Ark. 😉

    The Torah was written with the coming (of) Christ in mind. Jesus did accept Adam and Eve, Noah, Babel, Moses and Exodus – *which were all real events.

    This is a centuries old, commonly abused Christian-apologetic tact based upon three belated erroneous propositions:

    1) hijacking authentic Late Second Temple Judaism/Messianism by Greco-Roman Church Fathers

    2) intentionally maligning it and in many cases changing it without authority or contextual expertise

    3) the two above actions are therefore crimes of impersonation — bogus interpretations of authentic, historical Zugot and Tannaitic Judaism (170 BCE — 220 CE), the very last pair (zugot) of the Sanhedrin was Shammai and Hillel. Greco-Roman church history (and modern Christianity) completely ignore this critical historical context and consequently MISINTERPRET the Mishnah, Talmud, and Tanakh which includes the Torah.

    Also, it is because of these three erroneous Christian propositions and their flawed, confused basis that the “Prince” of the Sanhedrin, or President in a modern term, was called in Mishnaic Hebrew Nasi. Because Mishnaic Hebrew is partly derived from the Eblaite language (an extinct Semitic language from Syria), Nasi had various phonemic and phonetic renderings, not excluding ones like “King” ushering in peace and order. Without intimately understanding these linguistic distinctions and subtleties, it is IMPOSSIBLE for Greek to precisely translate Mishnaic Hebrew and Syro-Aramaic into Greek with 100% accuracy cover to cover.

    During the tumultuous chaos in Judea between 6 CE — 70 CE and the fact that several 1st-century Jewish sects did NOT survive after Rome destroyed Jerusalem and the Temple, much of Mishnaic Hebrew (Biblical Hebrew) was also lost. And Ark, I believe I’ve mentioned to you and/or here before—or maybe over on Gary’s blog—that it was near impossible for a Greek-writing scribe to translate Mishnaic Hebrew to or from Syro-Aramaic, then from Syro-Aramaic into Koine Greek (the Septuagint) with 100% contextual perfection and accuracy. It did not happen, ESPECIALLY so many decades later (up to 70 to 110 yrs later!) the events the Canonical Greco-Roman Gospels portray. And the role of Nasi has similarities with a Nazir or Nazirite which can be easily confused (by a Greco-Roman) to be a Nazarean or Nasorean/Nazorean, all of which can sound very similar or near identical UNLESS you are fluent in Mishnaic Hebrew and Syro-Aramaic and the phonology of both.

    Hence, all of this is to say Ark that Robertson and all modern Christians are working from a completely defective Greco-Roman foundation NOT BASED on historical, religious, literary, or linguistic authenticity and accuracy. So everything he preaches is anything BUT reliable and mostly fantasy… as he is so obviously hooked on. 😉

    Liked by 2 people

    1. Hence the apparent confusion/ignorance of the author of Matthew for example in indentifying a Nasorean as one coming from a place rather than a sect.
      And we end up with Jesus of Nazareth rather than Jesus the Nasorean, which vindicates someone such as Rene Salm who has claimed for a long time now that Nazareth never existed in the time when someone called Jesus strutted his stuff around Galilee.

      Liked by 2 people

      1. “Jesus of Nazareth”

        LOL. Hardcore fans beg to differ. Jesus was never a member of Nazareth. An insignificant roadie or groupie, perhaps; but never a member.

        Liked by 1 person

        1. There may be some truth to this. I actually saw Nazareth at Sun City along with Wishbone Ash in 1987 and distinctly remember a long haired bearded bloke moving the drum kit after Nazareth’s performance (which was awful) and he dropped two cymbals and the bass drum, which was damaged. He was approached by someone who was likely the stage manager who crucified him: ”Jesus Christ, do you have any idea how much those things f****g cost!?”

          Liked by 2 people

          1. Well, there you go. To which Jesus undoubtedly replied, “Let him who is without skins, cast the first trombone.”

            Rumour has it that Jesus later worked for NIN because one of Trent Reznor’s albums brought him “Closer to God”.

            Liked by 1 person

      2. Yes! And several/many Jewish Rabbinical scholars also know and teach—to anyone who wants to honestly learn authentic Late Second Temple Judaism/Messianism—that the very first task the belated Greco-Roman Church Fathers (none of which were Jews with Homeland Sectarian Jewish educations or exemplary skill in Mishnaic Hebrew or Syro-Aramaic) was they had to retrofit Messianic prophesies to THEIR VERSION of a “Prince/King” into a caricature of Greek Apotheosis so that Gentiles could understand and relate.

        Enter Saul of Tarsus (Paul), a Herodian Jew, and his TOTAL hijacking/revision and overhaul of Judean Messianism. And as we know from “Christian” texts, Paul/Saul was hated by authentic Jews throughout Syria-Palestine… trying to make heretics of the Jews. He almost lost his life one or two times after pissing them all off! 😄 By 74 CE (the fall of Masada) most everything representing authentic STJM in Palestine was wiped out by the Roman Legions. Hence, no one left to correct and/or counter (with substantial Roman authority) what Saul/Paul and Greco-Roman Church Fathers were pawning to Gentiles—although biblical, historical scholars can indeed infer from the Gospels, Acts, and Epistles that many, many times surviving Homeland Jews were arguing to Greco-Roman “Christians” how horribly wrong (heretical) they were distorting, corrupting, and changing THEIR true Judaism/Messianism, e.g. Kingdom of God on Earth via Israel, NOT some fantasy mythical afterlife place popular in Hellenistic culture! 🙄🤦‍♂️

        And the rest, as they say, is history. Rome would of course win out in the end.

        Like

  6. At the risk of becoming tedious: the weakest link in Christianity (or most if not all other religions) lies in the Law of Contraction. To refresh, quite simply contradictions are impossible. Yup! You can’t have them.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. Contradictions are impossible?

      “I dare say you haven’t had much practice,” said the queen. “When I was your age, I always did it for half an hour a day. Why, sometimes I’ve believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast.”

      ~Lewis Carroll, ordained church deacon and author of “Alice’s Adventures in Wonderland”

      Liked by 2 people

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