Christianity – what’s the point?

From the time I found out that Moses was a work of fiction, Christianity has fascinated me. Ironic then that, during the entire time  I would have been considered a Christian, in the general cultural sense of vicars, sandwiches on the church lawn, and Church Parade with the scouts I never gave it a moment’s thought, which, I suspect, would be par for the course for practically all those I grew up with.

As I find history of this sort quite engrossing, I have read quite a lot, and watched just as much. Mostly on the internet. I have a few  Jesus-type books, but when you have read one story of how Jesus was preaching in the Synagogue at 12  and amazing his elders with his wisdom (sic) you’ve read them all, pretty much. Therefore, it’s far easier to access the meatier and honest material via a mouse than having to plow through a zillion pages of rhetoric, and contrary to what some might have one  believe, most of the really important stuff actually is freely available, and where you cannot get hold of the literature there is always Youtube. Let’s face it, even whining horrors the likes of William Lane Craig recognise the value of the video debate especially when you are trying to convince  Fundamentalist Fence Sitters that , ”No, there is absolutely nothing wrong with Divinely Inspired/Commanded Genocide.”

So you’ve studied the Greek texts, maybe even extended yourself to Hebrew or Aramaic. You are au fait with all the ontological arguments, have  immersed yourself in hermeneutics, and learned all about biblical exegeses.

But ultimately, it all boils down to the question of life after death. Heaven and Hell. And as there is much debate regarding the nature of Hell among Christian Cults and the I’m-not-religious-but-a- Jesus Follower-honestly! crowd we are really only talking about Heaven.

And of course, even if it is all true, and even you are a devout believer, you will never know until after you die whether you have actually passed muster and get to Pass GO

Everything else about Christianity is simply background noise.

So the only questions that remain are:

What is the point of Christianity and what is the point of being a Christian?

 

And while you are thinking of something to write … here’s Blue Oyster Cult.

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125 thoughts on “Christianity – what’s the point?

  1. I love it when you post things on religion and questions like these. In one paragraph I had to look up four words to fully understand the meaning. To live is to learn, to learn is to take deeper enjoyment of life. I don’t know the answer to your question, I see dogmatic ritual as anti-enjoyment in life. I there is no difference between my Pagan friends who claim to feel energy of the universe ( planet, moon, essence of life ) and what Mels is saying he believes. They both believe it for the same reason, a feeling they had reinforced it and it makes them feel good. Maybe that is the thing about christianity, it just makes them feel good.

    I did want to ask you something about Mel. Mel says he doesn’t force his religion on the secular system, he doesn’t try to change people, he doesn’t try to make them believe as he does. If that is the case that he is doing his thing and not harming anyone, is it fair or right to point out the errors and flaws of his beliefs? Nan wrote she is not trying to de-convert him. I was on the point of pointing out the pagan friend thing and who every religion’s belief based on feeling contradicts the next one based on feeling. Now I am not sure I should. It seems mean to me some how, and I don’t like to be mean for no reason. Thanks. Hugs

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    1. You are a good soul.Scottie ( in the non-religious sense of soul, of course ) Too nice for the likes of moi…
      I take the view that, if this garbage is brought out into the open then be prepared to entertain all-comers. And as they say: Put up up, or push off!

      All you need to know about Mel is he comes across as a wheedling, I’m-not-really-a-fundamentalist-but-i am-really, pseudo intellectual apologetic Dick.
      But as I’m in a good mood I won’t write what I really feel. 😉

      I think your approach is just fine. Don’t try to be like anyone else but you.

      Liked by 5 people

    2. Scottie, in “conversing” with believers online, you will never de-convert them. You can, however, offer various and sundry points for them to think about in the privacy of their own thoughts (they will never admit to anything in public). Also, as Ark has mentioned before, there are nearly always “lurkers” who may very well be seeking answers to questions they’ll never find in a church setting or from their church leaders. So go for it! But my advice in doing so is to always remain courteous and as unemotional as possible or you will defeat your purpose.

      JMO

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      1. Thank you Nan. I did not think of others reading the comments but in a way that is what I normally do, read them and then think on it. I do not feel the need to make others see my way except when they are hurting someone. Then I will fight hard to get them to see. But to just take a comfort blanket away from someone who needs it seems ….wrong to me. But what Ark and you said makes sense. So I will ask Mel if he wants to continue and if he does I will also. Thanks. Hugs

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      1. Not that I can see. They do like to find a private place to do some naked stuff sometimes and of course some see that as wrong. Also the religious types see them as devil worshipers which I think is funny. No in truth they are a live and let live bunch. Thanks. A good way to look at it. Hugs

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      2. ”Do your pagan friends”
        I always understood that it was gay people who drove around suburban suburbs at night in pimped- up panel vans, wearing Chanel No5 Speedos and designer pumps, knocking on people’s front doors and generally ruining the fabric of society.

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            1. I am on the other committee. But when I get up in rank I will be able to the knock on doors. I tried to get on the committee that wears next to nothing at parades but they said I was unqualified. Hugs

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    3. Scottie:

      You raise issues about Mel. Ol’ Mel is an interesting study in itself. I can’t be bothered going into his background but I gather that he is a professional ‘Jesus pusher’ and his income, livelihood, home and entire well-being rests on harvesting his flocks.
      Good luck to him—such reapers and their sheep deserve each other (and we must admire a successful con-game for what it is).

      It would actually be worse if Mel didn’t make his buck from shearing his flock—if he were a total amateur doing it all for “love of Christ”. Brrrr … there are quite enough insane and deluded running around already without successful salespeople adding to the lists.

      Does he harm anyone? Certainly not his own bank balance, but in so much as he is actively defending and propagating delusions, yes. Oh yes. Oh very very yes. Insane? I’d be justifiably locked away if I stood on street corners or knocked on doors to earnestly push the case for visitations from the seventh dimension trying to establish a beachhead in NZ prior to invading the world. No? (Devils and demons by another name, Scottie?)

      If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck …

      When I was a kid I was afraid to go into the pine forests near our home because of wolves. It was only when I’d added on a few more years that I realised there were/are no wolves in the England of the time, or New Zealand. Yet still the literature is full of wolves in forests and little girls in red coats … and angels and demons …

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      1. I don’t know much about Mel. You all know him far better than I. I met him on a blog of one of the people here. He seemed nice. I asked him a couple questions on church and state, and how he feels about gays and keeping religion out of school. He seemed to agree with me on all of these. He agreed with keeping church and state separate, and had no problem with gays and did not want to push religion in schools. So I figured he was telling me the truth and I did not bother with him again until yesterday. I will feel bad if he misrepresented himself to me. Thanks Argus. Hugs

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        1. That’s how I think of any (R) any crusader or other religioso, Scottie. I look for the contradictions in the first instance, and the good old ‘Cui bono?’ (as in ‘who stands to gain, here?’).

          I trust politicians before priests and for good reason—pollies are more open about it.

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  2. The point is to get into Heaven, a place no one should want to go. A place in which you have no free will, There is no ambition, there is nothing to learn, nothing happens, you don’t become “better,” you don’t grow, excuse me but who would want to go there? Living forever to do … what? It seems as if one added up the number of words in the Bible that described Hell and the number that described Heaven, Hell would win hands down. Hell is the “stick” and Heaven the “carrot” but they don’t want you to know any specifics about the carrot, other than it is “wonderful.” Full of wonders it may be, but after a few hundred thousand years they would all be ho hum.

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    1. Exactly, Steve. The thought of spending eternity where you can’t even demand the boss to hand over the TV remote or even to tell IT to ”Fuck off” is as rancid and vacuous a goal as one could imagine.

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    2. I like how Christopher Hitchens describes it as North Korea. I watched a cartoon on darkmatter2525 that showed people in heaven miserable because for an eternity all they do is praise god while genuflecting to him. That would be the worst punishment I think. Hugs

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    3. Steve …
      given the choice of eternal harps with everlasting praises, or eternal boozing and relishing my very own personal seventy-two houris … Christ doesn’t get a look in; I’d convert like a shot. IF I believed such wishful nonsenses.

      But Hell would have much the more interesting company (all the bloody popes, for a start).

      Liked by 1 person

  3. Yeah, I think the point is rather evident for most — the promise of future reward (afterlife). I spent close to 8 hours researching Mel’s Four Square beliefs and the founder of the denomination. I didn’t intend to invest that much time, but I got sucked down the controversial rabbit hole. It’s amazing to me that people who are supposedly so close to ‘God’ are plagued with loneliness. I guess god planned for her to die from an overdose of barbiturates so she could be closer to him.

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      1. Crossing the line? Not on my end. I’m not sure what you dug up, but I learned that the Foursquare denomination Mel is associated with (a member of) believes that people are punished eternally — that they (the “true Christians”) are called to cast out demons and raise the dead; that humans are born depraved and deserve death. I got a kick out of all the theatrics of the founder of Foursquare. It was dubbed “The best show in town.” She was quite animated and knew the tricks of the trade which are still used today. Even Charlie Chaplin and other celebrities visited the mega church to learn her theatrical techniques. According to the United States Department of Labor’s Consumer Price Index, Angelus Temple’s construction would cost $3,245,964.91 in 2014.

        For those who may not know, the International Church of the Foursquare Gospel, as it’s called, was founded by Aimee Semple McPherson. She believed that god had allowed her to almost die to get her attention and submit. She heard voices. Sound familiar? During the Scopes Monkey Trial in 1925, McPherson organized a theatrical church production depicting what “Sister Aimee” called “the hanging and burial of monkey teachers.” She tried to get public schools to ban the teaching of evolution. In 2003, Jack Hayford was brought in to preside over the Foursquare Gospel denomination after its previous head was implicated in a church-based financial Ponzi-scheme to the tune of $15 million.

        http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/SAN-FRANCISCO-Foursquare-sinner-forgiven-2753996.php

        From what I gathered, after reading several sources, Hayford endorsed the “sex with a succubus-based economic model (theory)” which is part of an ideological construct known as “spiritual mapping” — meaning the taking of geographic territory, by driving out demons. This theory proposed “that a supernatural mechanism drove down Japanese stock market prices during the early 1990’s: the Japanese emperor’s alleged sexual intercourse with a “sky goddess” who, according to the theory, might be a succubus.”

        http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bruce-wilson/ensign-church-head-endors_b_244857.html

        Oh, and Scottie, one of the kindest human beings on the planet? Yeah, he’s going to also be tossed in the lake of fire along with the rest of us heathens. The traditional, biblical stand on homosexual practice was affirmed in 1993 by the Foursquare church.

        “The Scriptures identify the practice of homosexuality as a sin that, if persisted in, brings grave consequences in this life and excludes one from the Kingdom of God.”

        While I know that they have made an effort to reach out (show love) to the LGBT community, the ultimate message is clear.

        Sorry, this is so long, but I want to also mention that the founder disappeared for 5 weeks, and claimed she’d been kidnapped by Mexicans. No evidence was found that she had been kidnapped. Many believed it was a publicity stunt, a hoax. It still remains an unsolved mystery.

        http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-30148022

        While she was very well liked, did many good things for people during the depression, and promoted the message of “love”, I kept getting red flags the more I read. A while back, on your blog, I tried to find out what Mel believed regarding hell, but I never got a clear answer. I quoted Revelation, and he indicated that the lake of fire mentioned in the scriptures I shared were not regarding Jesus’ judgement (end times). So I check out their Declaration of Faith compiled by Aimee Semple McPherson, which can be found on his church’s website. It reads:

        “We believe that hell is a place of outer darkness and deepest sorrow, where the worm dieth not and the fire is not quenched; a place prepared for the devil and his angels, where there shall be weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth, a place of grief and eternal regret on the part of them who have rejected the mercy, love and tenderness of the crucified Savior, choosing death rather than life; and that there into a lake that
        burns with fire and brimstone
        shall be cast the unbelieving, the abominable, the murderers, sorcerers, idolaters, all liars, and they who have rejected and spurned the love and sacrifice of a bleeding Redeemer, — passing the cross to their doom, in spite of every entreaty and warning of the Holy Spirit.

        While Mel and others may be sincere in their beliefs, they use a seductive message of love that draws people in (likely the most vulnerable), and then eventually drops the hell and demon bomb on ’em, like most conservative Christian clergy do. You are aware how harmful, and even deadly, these teachings can be.

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        1. What has any of this to do with ol’ Mel’s beloved Dream?

          I’m sure the followers of the good reverend Jones (of Kool Aid fame) are all snug in the arms of Jesus now, and pulling faces down at us … I guess it’s Mel’s ambition to join them? But these droolers after eternal bliss never seem in any hurry, though …

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          1. Yes, they appear to take an infernal delight in tormenting those already doomed and want to drag out the suffering for those poor souls(sic) who will inevitably be joining them eating Raisins for eternity.

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        2. When I read you mention a death I was not sure if you were referring to someone close to him, but quickly realised you were talking about McPherson, and I read much of what you have referenced.

          Mel is a classic indoctrinated obfuscating apologist-type continually trying to base his approach on the (my) ignorance of whoever he is in dialogue with, cherry- picking his references very much in the manner of one such as Unklee.
          Although I reckon Scottie has him pegged in their latest round of dialogue. You can see how far he is having to stretch without actually feeling obliged to directly answer Scottie’s questions. Scottie has the patience of Job.

          Such people as Mel seem to believe deconverts were never proper Christians and thus merit less regard than people like me for whom they might consider there may be a chance to ”save”. Yet, to be honest, I am pretty sure that by now, Mel, Unk et al have probably handed me over to the Devil!

          Also, I think Bruce Gerenscer might disagree slightly about their views regarding former Christians.
          😉 .
          Not to mention, You, Zoe, Ken,Nan,Nate etc.

          I see no reason at all to ”play nice” with such people.
          Their message is vile.

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          1. “When I read you mention a death I was not sure if you were referring to someone close to him”

            Thanks for the clarification. You know, it didn’t take me finding out that there was no Exodus, etc, to question the validity of Christianity. My deconversion was a lone journey, and without the input of other deconverts, or the internet. This was before online ex-Christian communities. Diligently studying the Bible (including the original languages), not as a skeptic, but as someone who was quite sincere in my faith, was the catalyst. But, I also observed familiar patterns in every church/denomination I was a member of over the course of 20 years (in adulthood). Their church and/or denomination was the “True” one.

            It’s like siblings believing they are the one most favored by their parent(s). It was haughty behavior, and it became apparent to me that Christianity was impotent, and so was it’s god and followers. I also came to realize that believers didn’t understand the definition of unconditional love. Love without conditions.

            You wrote: “Such people seem to believe deconverts were never proper Christians”

            Such people have never gone the distance. It was when we were closest to Jesus (God) that we discovered he didn’t exist.

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            1. Victoria, you fought a hard fight without support or aid. You deserve our appreciation for what you were able to do, and how you are always willing to give to others going through that journey. You are grand. Hugs

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                1. To be honest Victoria I never thought how hard it must be for people who are deep in a religion to leave until everyone talked on Nan’s blog about it. When I think it was your social circle, your support system, your emergency contacts, your daily interactions. It reminded me of me leaving the Army. it was super hard to decide to leave, and they put a lot of pressure on me to stay. Then when I got to civilian life stateside I was lost. For years I had lived with, played with, worked with, ate with,taken vacations with, been sick with, and did everything with about the same group of people. We were family. We were taken care of by our units and the army, we had security , a place to live, we could go to school or shop or play at places provided by our boss and employer. you get wrapped up in that world. I almost went back in. in two weeks I lost track of the number of times I reached for the phone. They say a lot of people do reenlist just because of that. So yes you did a great hard thing. Plus you now go back into it to help others, and that amazes me. SO my hat is off to all of the deconverts and the price you all piad. many loving hugs.

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                2. That’s a good analogy, Scottie. I will say that I never had the desire to return. Also, deconverts (especially in conservative communities) are usually treated as though they are now the enemy. That’s because, according to the bible, we are. Unconditional love, my arse. I once was blind, but now I see. 🙂

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        1. “The church [Foursquare] teaches that salvation is by grace through faith and not by good works.”

          Lovely. So they don’t lift a finger to help, and think they’re going to be rewarded for being wastes of space and air.

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                1. There are some really shitty people honored in these religions. I can see wanting to honor past heros of your herd, but if you have better morals than the saint, isn’t it time to retire the saint? Even if you can’t take the sainthood away, you can disavow what they did and stop any official mention of the creeps. Or am I missing something? Hugs

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                2. Missing nothing at all, Scottie, I assure you.
                  And it was interesting to read that the Muslim Council of the UK has completely disavowed the terrorists and their actions of the recent attack in London and will not be offering prayers for the murderers – an unprecedented move, I understand.
                  No Virgins for those blokes then … or Raisins.
                  Baby Steps?

                  And still on disavowing …
                  Mother Theresa is another one, if you are inclined to look a little closer – as Christopher Hitchens did.
                  Nowhere near in the same league as Constantine or Torquemada but still a major con-artist in her own right.

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                3. Ron said Mother Teresa sounds like a sadist. I think he is correct as she like to keep and watch people in suffering. As long as it was not her. She went to real hospitals when she was sick. She raised a lot of money but did not use it for the ill people, those she said were closer to god for suffering. So why did she not have to suffer to be close to god? Just another scam and a jerk who was talking one thing for everyone else and for themselves doing something totally different. It is a case of I am privileged but you are not. Like politicians who refuse to increase minimum wage but then raise their own pay. creeps, they are all selfish creeps. hugs

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                4. It was also where she got a lot of the money from.
                  Corrupt to the core.
                  But then, so is the ”Firm” she belongs to.
                  I once read that the Catholic Church is the largest private owner of real estate n the world.
                  MacDonalds came second.

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                5. Hello Ark. Here is the link to the comment that basically started it all. https://melwild.wordpress.com/2017/06/16/the-nature-of-biblical-inspiration/comment-page-1/#comment-7795
                  What it came down to is he got feelings from his god.
                  ————————————-
                  Okay. As I told Ark, you can probably find it in the 600+ posts! But I will tell you because I think you honestly want to know.

                  I follow Christ because I found a love that’s overwhelming and life-changing. There’s no one who more brilliantly has His finger on the pulse of humanity than Jesus; His truth is so deep and multi-faceted. I’ve been transformed by His empowering grace. I have found a ridiculously loving Father who loves me unconditionally and affirms me as a son. It’s not based on theories or arguments but on a real relationship that I live out every day. I have joy on my worst days because of His life in me as an anchor of hope. I rejected religion (conformity to outward ritual) and have found what the early Christians were willing to die for. I have found the meaning to life and that I have value and purpose (you do, too, btw).

                  If you are interested in more, I would suggest two of my blog posts:
                  “Why I Write”
                  “Everything you need to know in ten minutes”
                  Blessings to you.
                  ——————————————–
                  I then replied as you can see from the comments that everyone gets that from their religion and even pagans get it. At that point he sort of started to agree, then abruptly veered off into only his god given feelings were valid and others were not, or so I took what he was saying to mean. When I told him how I felt about that and tried to clarify what he meant he cut the conversation off saying he would make a post on it and he had to go.
                  OK, when you look at the link in the comment it is all right there. Please let me know your thoughts of it all. Appreciate it. Hugs

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                6. It’s the sex, drugs, and rock ‘n roll nonsense all over.
                  I find him to be a disingenuous little Sunbeam for Jesus, and, quite frankly, I wouldn’t let him babysit my pet gerbil.
                  While the Ken Ham types are real nutters that need to pilloried and have rotten veg thrown at them, and afterwards forced to pay back taxes ’til they have to rob the poor box in a Catholic Church.
                  But these so-called religion shunning Jesus Followers with their schmaltzy lines and thinly veiled condescension, and their cherry picking ignorance make my skin crawl.
                  It’s almost as bad as accidentally discovering a porn movie with William Lane Craig and Pat Robertson in the starring roles.
                  Now you will probably have nightmares for the weekend … sorry.

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                7. I agree with you. I tried to give him the benefit of the doubt but when he claimed that his feelings were valid and the others same feelings from a different god were not valid, he lost a lot of credibility in my view. I believe what is good for the goose is also good for the gander. I will keep talking to him and let him show me he is not just an old age fundamentalist in new age sheeps clothing. Thanks to everyone for the info posted here yesterday and the question you posed Ark. Hugs

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                8. It is said that the question reveals as much about the person asking it as it does the person it is directed at.
                  And I think you exposed his nonsense better than most, as he seemed to feel inwardly compelled to answer you.
                  Perhaps I am just a tad forthright? 😉
                  However, let us remember that in times past I would likely have been burned at the stake for asking such a question. You too for that matter, probably after attempting to relieve you of your ”soul” even before lighting the kindling.
                  These days it is far easier to simply shun the individual, lie to them, or tell them they were never True Christians in the first place.
                  Or if you are a Muslim, blow you up.

                  All because God Loves You.

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                9. One reason the religious people shy away from any questions from you is that you have studied all this stuff and know it well. You can’t be bluffed nor lied too. In the discussion on authorship I would have had to take their word for it. It was not until recently I understood there was no exodus. So I am easier an easier target maybe? Keep fighting the fight Ark. I would like to live in a really free secular world where people don’t lie, steal, hurt, destroy and murder in the name of a myth. You and the rest here really do open eyes. Hugs

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                10. I know some of it reasonably well.
                  Peter is a walking theological encyclopedia, and John could ”kill” me in most of the archaeology dept.
                  I am quite familiar with the basic tenets and like to ask those rather pointed questions.
                  And I try to consider the lurkers who might read along.

                  But all the religious knowledge in the world still does not get a Christian to answer honestly ”What is the point of Being a Christian”, as you just found out in discussion with Mel.

                  Victoria has often pointed out that it is little more than a brutal Death Cult.

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        2. Ark, I see you’ve done some digging, too. Just noticed your link. Wasn’t sure how far down the rabbit hole you’d gone, yourself, so my last comment was most likely redundant, but I was just scratching the surface.

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  4. Christianity- what’s the point?

    To ask the question is to admit cluelessness as to what exactly it is. So nice work ark.

    You ave laid bare your hand, but then again, this is something I have always known about your fraudulent ways.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Yay, kiddies! Look who’s come to play! It’s Mr Flatheadearth.

      Yes, I am clueless as to what is the point of Christianity. You are perfectly correct.
      This is exactly why I asked it.
      As you are the only True Believer that visits these days, perhaps you would be so kind to provide an answer?

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      1. Awww Ark! Now why did you have to go and ask that question of our “beloved” CS? You know he’s going to respond with his usual round-and-round-we-go poetic garbage. Haven’t you had enough yet? Sheesh!

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        1. But we need an answer from a proper Christian, not you backsliding never-were apostates that come here just to show off how much more you know about Christianity than True Christians.

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        1. Well, my style is my style. This does not for one second mean I am not genuinely interested in the answer to what is the Point of being a Christian?
          Hit me with your best shot, as Pat Benetar once sang.

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        2. @CS
          Hey, why not write one of your lengthy pieces of flowery prose on the subject?
          That way you can censor all my comments and show everyone what a fraud I am!
          How cool would that be?
          Go one….be a lamb Do it for me.
          You know you want to.

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          1. It is not my intention to embarrass anybody ark.

            ‘The entrance of thy word giveth light………..’ Not my words but man oh man are they true.

            Perhaps you have better words that bringeth light?

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              1. Now there is a subject for the ages:

                The varying degrees of darkness. Nighttime suggests a certain degree, but rats don’t seem to mind. Then there are owls, bless them.

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                1. I suspect the darkness you were in might very well involve Horse to give it one of it’s names. After all, you do so love the drama, and spreading the theological rose fertilizer so this would no doubt seem quite apt … or ironic.
                  Nod’s as good as a wink to none so blind as those who will not see, right?
                  So pray, John, do tell. Were there plants and birds and rocks and things with this Horse with No Name, or was your god the 40w light bulb moment?

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                2. Hilarious. You think the words of Rod Stewart have a shelf life compatible with Solomon, Moses, Daniel, Peter, John, or Paul the apostle.

                  Where oh where is my darn laff button………

                  A thousand years from today, ole Rod will be a pimple in music history, and there will arrive another cadre of people who say Solomon, Moses, Paul, and Christ never lived.

                  Press laff button again.

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                3. Rod Stewart? Oh, dear. You do disappoint me, John.
                  Maybe, in truth, you really see no point in being a Christian, only you needed something to hide behind?

                  Obviously pop culture or is not your forte.
                  And neither is Christianity, it seems.

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    1. Amazing isn’t?
      Such a huge important part of the entire story and foundational to all three Abrahamic religions and yet so many simply cannot accept it is simply Historical Fiction.

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        1. There is no fathoming it. We can all watch Dr Who and realise the fictitious nature of the show even if there are scientific elements mixed in with the fantasy. But who would swear it is fact and based on actual historical events?

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    2. Sorry mike-

      You were long over the edge before you decided scripture was subject to your disappointments.

      Since the narrative is fine, your heart is obviously suspect. Sorry, tis a fact.

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      1. Hi cs. Have you fallen of the edge of the flat earth yet?
        Your reasoning and intelligence is extremely suspect for thinking you have evidence and reason enough to ridicule modern scientific knowledge about the earth being a sphere just like any other planet in out system. Have a wonderful day from 112 degree Phoenix

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        1. Ha! the ‘modern scientific knowledge’ that knows less than .003 % of the world’s oceans?

          Meanwhile, back in reality, God’s word has long presented the ‘fountains of the great deep,’ a truth just observed in your lifetime by your heroes of modern science. 😉

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          1. “gods word” didn’t even know about germs or tell us why it’s God created the deadly buggers in the first place. The bible is worse than ignorant, it’s criminally negligent if it was actually written by a god with omniscience and all compassion.
            Good thing there is no such evidence that such a being authored it at all. Have a wonderful day cs

            Liked by 2 people

              1. I seriously think you must still be on drugs, John. Or you struggle with a form of psychopathy.
                I’ve probably read most of your blog pieces over the past couple of years, though, I’ll admit , not all, and you have, right from the outset struck me as one is very likely in a place of confinement.

                Although your writing does, on occasion, have some sort of poetic quality, it has slowly regressed to the point that there are times it becomes almost incoherent.
                Your recent flat earth post, the one with the video, most definitely had a few of your regular star-struck fawning god bothering regulars looking askance at each other. Hanging with mentally unstable individuals no matter how much they seemed steeped in drug induced holiness is hardly good for the street cred of the average Jesus Follower.

                Not once, in all the time I have read you, here or anywhere else, have you struck me as a mentally stable individual.

                I wonder if you would ever be prepared to tell us your story?

                Liked by 1 person

                1. Tks ark for the accolades. Others may be able to see the veiled compliment as well. 😉

                  As to your assessment of a stationary earth, I can say with full confidence that you, and others, including Christians, have not studied the matter to draw the correct conclusions. It’s ok. Many good people have disagreed.

                  But your greater problem is the fact that some believers agree with you. You should find this revolting, because the same people revere scripture and the God created earth.

                  Go ahead. Try to prove it wrong.

                  Like

          2. Oh I will hate myself in the morning…..OH well just jump in old man….@colorstorm you said and I reproduce with some laughing “back in reality, God’s word has long presented the ‘fountains of the great deep…”. OK so lets see a picture of the ‘fountains of the great deep. What are the measurements. How deep is it, wide is it. Hey what is the temperature. See science can tell us those things and so much more. Sciences are learning more new great things every day. The bible has the same wrong ideas it has for the last centuries since the last rewrite. Hugs

            Liked by 1 person

            1. Hi scott-

              Do the research. It is obvious that the Creator of the oceans is light years ahead of what ‘modern science’ discovers.

              The ‘fountains of the great deep’ and springs at the oceans floors, are a modern discovery, meanwhile, back in reality………………….. 😉

              God wrote all about it. Take it or leave it.

              Like

              1. You sidestepped my question. Are you saying god doesn’t know? No worries, I won’t think less of it for not being all knowing. However he could have done two things. He could google it and then inspire some descendant of a common ancestor human to update the dusty old book.
                But that leaves the powerful all knowing god field open to another god to claim the spot if they have the information.
                Now I asked and you dodged, please don’t again. Science tells me the details of things, it gives as clear a view as we have yet of things. Science is updating and updatable. Where in your tome is the information you claimed god provides. The research has been done by intelligent people using their evolved brains. IF you think not then show the information on the deep please. Depth of the deep, width, temperature, consistency. Describe the nature of the vents coming it to the deep, which create the fountains. I am willing to be impressed ColorStorm. Impress me with the knowledge of you god. Hugs

                Like

                1. Sorry scott if this issue is above your pay grade.

                  And your jab about God ‘not knowing’ proves your jokery is not worthy of answering in detail.

                  Like

                2. OH dear, don’t get the vapors ColorStorm. You have upheld your title as troll. Sadly you are slipping in rank. You are using old material dude. Look we can help you, do you have twitter? There is some good hints there. Take a bit of the truth and bend it slightly to meld into the fake stuff you’re pushing. Also you are missing opportunities to score “dip shit living in the folks basement” points by not mentioning a detail about the other person you can then use to marginalize them because your child god’s followers had a beef with it. Look someone jealous that young Jesus had a thing for well toned guys, a little afternoon fishing delight, so they had it put in the book it was a no no. Throw that stuff around, it makes your deity look all stand up and studly. Need any more tips I think Milo Yiannopoulos is still needing work, he could mentor you. Hugs

                  Like

                3. @scott

                  An atheist has never, let me repeat, Never, once more NEVER won an argument against God or scripture.

                  So sez scripture, common sense, nature, logic, and of course the greatest proof of all: your conscience.

                  Since you cannot assess this nor adjudicate correctly, it speaks to your state of mind.

                  cheers.

                  Like

                4. Sweetie, you just keep telling yourself that and it will take the swelling out..with an ice pack. 🙂 Really kitty you have not shown anything to lose too. You can not provide the information because your elf in wing tip shoes you call god has not provided you with anything you can reply with. No numbers, no updated information, because the old geezers in the sandlands did not know about these things, and so couldn’t pretend some all big and scary knew it. So if you want to show some god here it is simple. Give me the data you claim it gives you and where in the book most know is really a collections of political junk for that time frame called the bible. Really my grand Purring one, just show me where in the book it is , all this data that is so far ahead of our latest science. You can do it, I have faith..( got to giggling and spit some of my ice cream ) in you. You made the claim feline impersonator, you whip it out and put it on the table. Hugs

                  Liked by 1 person

                5. You want data? Read the Dow Jones Stock index.

                  You want truth? Read the scriptures. I can’t spoon feed you what you are able to digest on your own.

                  But enough of the compliments already.

                  Like

                6. Silly boy, it is ok for you to admit you don’t know them. You can admit that your holly dust collector called the bible doesn’t supply any way for you to prove it is the defining work of a bipolar multi personality possibly drunk work of a deity. Don’t take it personally. There are a lot of people in the same boat. You need to read Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health to see how a cult really gets revved up. On and sport, you still are not getting any points for the I can’t thing. Did not that book of bad grammar called the holy bible tell you to go out and TELL people. Doesn’t it say to SHOW. SO do some show and tell and stop trying to get out of your job. I can’t do it for you, how would you get heaven points. You will lose your coupons for the right hand seat. Again you made the statement ” the Creator of the oceans is light years ahead of what ‘modern science’ discovers.” so please back it up or we have no choice but to determine your words are false and so it your god. We know that already but we are trying to bring you along slowly so you don’t strain your brain and have diarrhea all night. Hugs

                  Like

                7. I’ll say it scott while your friends praise you:

                  You bore me with your ignorance of scripture. Maybe I should tell you of God’s designed irrigation systems which are ecologically perfect……..

                  Oh but wait……….your hero scientists have improved upon nature……….. lol

                  Like

                8. Ah ColorStorm you paragon of virtue. You bore me with your ignorance of reality. You know you keep failing to show and tell about your god by answering the simplest of questions you claimed your god had already known about and knew more of. Sorry if this is making you cry dude, but you made the positive claim. You need to back it up. IF you can’t or won’t, then it means you are incorrect.
                  Look ColorStorm, I do not know anything about you. I sort of feel I am taking advantage of someone of limited mental ability. I feel I am breaking the truth about the easter bunny to a young kid. You simply seem totally unable to understand english and the world around you. Here is your chance to save face. Simply admit you don’t know anything about science … just make up a reason. You were homeschooled, church schooled, not schooled, uninterested in bettering yourself, lazy, unable to understand it, are something you can use. Dude you really are like the kid in third grade arguing with the entire high school math class that 2+2=5. You can’t show the work to prove it, you can’t be bothered to show where in the text it tells you this. Heck you won’t even let the big kids explain to you why you are wrong. You admit now you can not show your god new anything about the “deep”. It is OK, go back to cuddling your stuffed animal and have a small glass of milk before bed. We won’t tell on you. Oh who am I kidding, of course we will tease you on it, you big old goofy hairball. Hugs

                  Like

              2. @ Colostorm.
                Ah … Mr Flatheadearth.

                Looks like more of your Strait-Jacket, Sunday-School Soteriology, I see?

                There is only one thing deeper than the oceans; Colorstorm’s Pernicious Persistent Prose.
                He is the Curmudgeonly Christian doing his Calamitous Calisthenics.
                Like Putrefying Pigeon Poop he Peppers a thread,
                With Insecure Imbecilic Invocations
                He leaves a Trail of Turpitude while his Past (its sell-by-date)-Participle is dangled.
                No King of the Jungle, I’m afraid, but the Quintessential
                Queen of the Quixotic.
                The Fraudulent Faux Follower of a Royally Fucked-Up Fellowship.

                (Beat that you Bitch-Slapped Boor! )

                Like

                1. And so to answer your question Christianity what is it?

                  One facet is: not returning evil for evil………… 😉

                  But I should be so flattered to have gained such wonderful and thoughtful attention.

                  Like

                2. In actual fact, the question is Christianity – what’s the point?
                  Is honesty also not part of your faith, or do you simply have trouble reading?
                  Trust me, there is no need to exercise any form of hermeneutics, just interpret the Blog Title exactly as it stands, and answer accordingly.
                  If you have the integrity to do so that is?

                  Like

                3. What is it? is more to your point. 😉

                  Ever heard of the relationship between the head and the body?

                  That is, the Head and His body? A body all of one, with members each having a purpose that others cannot fulfill.

                  But of course you know that science tells you that your little second right toe cannot perform that of the left index finger, with full support of course by the Head, Who directs perfectly and consistently. 😉

                  A body suited not for breathing underwater or living in a birds nest, but a body as it pleased the Creator.

                  Study the uniqueness of the body, and have your own questions answered. But don’t get too wrapped up in bodies who run unsent, like beasts with seven heads.

                  So there you go ark, food for thought. Glad to help.

                  Like

                4. Ah, and more of your Obstreperous Obfuscating.
                  Is this Finger-up-your-arse Fatalist Fundamentalism Finally Fucking up your Fervent F … Phenomology?
                  As you can’t Help yourself, what in your Halitosis Huffed Hubris would make you think you could could Help anyone else?

                  Like

                5. … your little second right toe cannot perform that of the left index finger

                  And THIS is supposed to be a convincing argument for your god? And the answer to Ark’s question?

                  If one can say anything positive about you at all is that you are the master of diversion.

                  Liked by 1 person

  5. I was watching some atheist channels on YouTube. Fundamentalist Christians interviewed stated that no matter what the facts, no matter what they were told, show, or had explained to them they simply refused to accept it. One said if it did not fit with what she believed then it was wrong. Her beliefs were correct in her mind so nothing, not even overwhelming evidence would be accepted. The people simply ignored it. They had nothing to disprove it, they simply said nope. I can’t understand that way of life and worldview. If a kid were to be like this they would be sent for examination and treatment. SO why don’t we do that with adults that don’t accept reality. IF a guy is standing on a street corner claiming there is a 8 foot tall rabbit he is talking with, that no one else can see, hear, or feel, they are said to be mentally ill. But if that same person is on the street corner claiming to talk to angels or god, we assume he is just religious. In truth I think they both need mental health help. Hugs

    Liked by 2 people

    1. I read somewhere that one reason is that, some of the standards (procedure) applied to mental health issues are somewhat different and given more leeway where religion is involved.
      God knows why …. excuse the pun.
      I do not know the exact details but I am sure Victoria will probably be able to give a fuller explanation if asked, or if he is still following along.
      Cooeee! Victoria … are you there?
      🙂

      Liked by 1 person

    2. I’m no Victoria, but I thought you might enjoy this quote from Douglas Adams who pondered the same thing. I think the answer to your question is that religion simply gets special treatment. Though there is no real reason for it other than it is likely a part of someone’s culture or ethnicity and since migration patterns tended to involve such groups it was perhaps a way of protecting large groups of people. Interestingly I find this quote a little dated because at least in the U.S. political views have also become somewhat like religion, although they are still not sacred to challenge.

      Now, the invention of the scientific method and science is, I’m sure we’ll all agree, the most powerful intellectual idea, the most powerful framework for thinking and investigating and understanding and challenging the world around us that there is, and that it rests on the premise that any idea is there to be attacked and if it withstands the attack then it lives to fight another day and if it doesn’t withstand the attack then down it goes. Religion doesn’t seem to work like that; it has certain ideas at the heart of it which we call sacred or holy or whatever. That’s an idea we’re so familiar with, whether we subscribe to it or not, that it’s kind of odd to think what it actually means, because really what it means is ‘Here is an idea or a notion that you’re not allowed to say anything bad about; you’re just not. Why not? – because you’re not!’ If somebody votes for a party that you don’t agree with, you’re free to argue about it as much as you like; everybody will have an argument but nobody feels aggrieved by it. If somebody thinks taxes should go up or down you are free to have an argument about it, but on the other hand if somebody says ‘I mustn’t move a light switch on a Saturday’, you say, ‘Fine, I respect that’. The odd thing is, even as I am saying that I am thinking ‘Is there an Orthodox Jew here who is going to be offended by the fact that I just said that?’ but I wouldn’t have thought ‘Maybe there’s somebody from the left wing or somebody from the right wing or somebody who subscribes to this view or the other in economics’ when I was making the other points. I just think ‘Fine, we have different opinions’. But, the moment I say something that has something to do with somebody’s (I’m going to stick my neck out here and say irrational) beliefs, then we all become terribly protective and terribly defensive and say ‘No, we don’t attack that; that’s an irrational belief but no, we respect it’.

      It’s rather like, if you think back in terms of animal evolution, an animal that’s grown an incredible carapace around it, such as a tortoise – that’s a great survival strategy because nothing can get through it; or maybe like a poisonous fish that nothing will come close to, which therefore thrives by keeping away any challenges to what it is it is. In the case of an idea, if we think ‘Here is an idea that is protected by holiness or sanctity’, what does it mean? Why should it be that it’s perfectly legitimate to support the Labour party or the Conservative party, Republicans or Democrats, this model of economics versus that, Macintosh instead of Windows, but to have an opinion about how the Universe began, about who created the Universe, no, that’s holy? What does that mean? Why do we ring-fence that for any other reason other than that we’ve just got used to doing so? There’s no other reason at all, it’s just one of those things that crept into being and once that loop gets going it’s very, very powerful. So, we are used to not challenging religious ideas but it’s very interesting how much of a furore Richard creates when he does it! Everybody gets absolutely frantic about it because you’re not allowed to say these things. Yet when you look at it rationally there is no reason why those ideas shouldn’t be as open to debate as any other, except that we have agreed somehow between us that they shouldn’t be.

      Liked by 1 person

  6. Good grief~! The point, silly person, is to make money. EOS.

    Gather ye wealth and power while ye may, etc etc, and such fables (essentially a ‘root-story’) (common tale adapted for time and place) are/is the best, quickest, and least costly way to do it.

    That Sir, is the point. Same point as Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, and any or all of the hundreds and thousands of other such ‘isms’.
    But wait, it gets better—even if your local ‘ism’ has gotten a bit threadbare, come up with a new slant and you’ll make yourself a real bundle. QED.

    Like

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